Sign Nothing, Without An Attorney Present

I just heard from an attorney who wrote this:

“The issue is this: by the time they call me, it’s too late, they signed the form. Once they sign the form, the case is over. If there was one thing I could tattoo onto every parent’s arm, it would be this: SIGN NOTHING WITHOUT AN ATTORNEY PRESENT.”

And to that, I’d add: Be sure the attorney is working in your best interest, and not for the county that seeks to oppress you.

If you sign a plea of any type in the juvenile court hearing, you’ll be giving up your right to a trial. Often the court appointed attorneys won’t tell you this. They don’t want a trial because it is a lot more work for the same amount of pay. The caseworkers don’t want a trial because they’d have to *prove* their case rather than just make allegations in their “social worker report” to the court.

If you’ve already made the mistake of signing a plea or stipulation in court, do everything you’re court ordered to do, plus write a declaration explaining your side of the case ***but, write nothing self-incriminatory*** and collect documentary evidence that you’ve completed the court-ordered services, and anything else that you can come up with that proves you’re a good parent. One single mother got ten children returned by the court after she showed the judge photographs of her home with beds ready for all the children. So, get busy on that evidence! You will need to share that with your attorney before court.

Filed under: Legal Issues — Linda Martin @ 9:05 am

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I feel totally lost.cps made me move out of my house and now even lost my girlfriend that had my doughter. It started as the hospitol. the forth night at the hospitol the nurse told us to have car seet ready for the morning. in the morning three ladys came in the room one asked to hold our doughter and we said sure,soon as she had her she said that she is taking her.I told my mom about the situation and that it is over neglect.i found do not go to do a drug ua even pritate. girlfriends lawyer told us after court to do a ua if we would like to show extra good for us .girlfriend said that we have done so and showed hers.I didnt show and the social worker had recieved without my concent. It screwed me bad to where sotial worker is doing illegal stuff to have me loose my rights.i have done every thing that i needed to do and even passed my drug assesment then went to court for them to post pone it because they had nothing on me.So they say now that they did a retest on my ua that i did for court that was 2 months old.they claim that it is pretty dirty and the first one wasnt. I have asked for a subpoena for 4 months and i can not have it done.I even contacted the D.A.C and i thought it was going to work and i got the same print out that i have all ready had. the ua has now signature showing true and complete. what can i do I feel that being on ssi is a good reason for this to be happening. i have court soon and i think there going to take my wrights to close the case as soon as they can to save there self, and that would put me on road to no future that i dreamed of. if you can help or give even give advice would be thankfull. e mail cnote8204[@]yahoo.com.

Comment by carlin — August 25, 2010 @ 6:35 pm

Carlin, when was your child born? They are supposed to give you a reunification plan. Possible terminations of rights don’t happen for about eighteen months.

Comment by Linda Martin — August 26, 2010 @ 9:46 am

4-year-old goes to church and says to SS teacher, “I got a spanking for lying, want to see?” this led to lifting shirt and seeing a large (older) scratch from a bicycle fall, along with the spanking bruise. Church was going to file with CPS. Family is heartbroken, betrayed, falsely accused. If SS teacher files, CPS could still come. What are parent rights, and what should their response be? I’m grandmother and know real “abuse” is not happening here.

Comment by Pat — August 31, 2010 @ 9:51 am

Pat, please contact an attorney right away. It is much better to be safe than sorry.

I don’t mean to alarm you but please start doing some research for attorneys who fight CPS in your area.

Comment by Maggiec — September 2, 2010 @ 5:51 pm

I am a father who is fighting for custody of two kids. my ex-wife lost them due to her drug use and finally relinquished her rights to them. I have been fighting for placement from day one and now they are ready to terminate my rights. The reason? My current wife is mentally handicapped but not so far as it affects parenting. She yells a lot but other than that she does a good job taking care of the kids we have. The states concerns about her are unsubstantiated. How can i convince the judge when everyone is against us getting the kids?
Thanks,
Concerned for my kids.

Comment by CHRIS — September 7, 2010 @ 8:32 am

Chris, you will need to take documentary evidence and legal documents to court. Please read the suggestions on this site, and join us on the message board. Do you have any expert witnesses willing to testify for you if you’re forced into a TPR hearing?

Comment by Linda Martin — September 8, 2010 @ 11:29 am

My ex husband called CPS in a different county and they gave him sole legal and physical custody because I had “popped” a 12yr old in her mouth for cussing..there was not a mark on her mouth! The CPS worker told the court my children were in immediate danger if returned to me. I have done their classes and asked to follow Supreme Court ruling in Crawford Vs Washington (2004) and have been denied. I have 2 other children and cannot afford an attorney.

Comment by Traci — September 10, 2010 @ 12:00 pm

Traci, you’re lucky you still have the other two children. Please join us on the message board if you want feedback on your case. However – if your daughter is with a family member, it is possible you won’t be getting her back. Still, you never know.

Comment by Linda Martin — September 10, 2010 @ 2:08 pm

My ex falsely accused my husband of touching my daughter in her “area.” My daughter told my ex this when my ex gave her a bath and dried her off. I know this to be false because I am home ALL the time, I have no job right now. Where ever I am, my daughter is. Where ever my daughter is, I am, unless she is visiting with her father. If something had happened, I would know, and I would not still be with my husband if something had happened.

CPS is taking my daughter (3yrs) into custody until the investigation is over. What do I do!? They are going to serve me Temporary Custody papers soon and we can’t get hold of an attorney right now… please help!!

Comment by Leigh from Arizona — September 10, 2010 @ 5:03 pm

I was going through domestic violence issues with my fiance the judge ordered a no contact order for me against him. He was not allowed to return to the home where my two children and I are. I was not able to afford rent.I was forced to move to a domestic violence shelter. After the shelter I went and stayed with my sister.
Then I was picked up on a warrant for not paying a traffic ticket. So my stepmother took my daughter. Both of my children are handicapped. I was in jail for 2 days and when I got out I found out cps has taken m children. They receive 10 complaints on me in a period of a month all were unsubstantiated. The lawyer i have keeps telling me to sign my rights off and i cant afford one. I neeeeeed help asap.

Comment by Kassy — September 15, 2010 @ 2:40 pm

……… I was involved years ago due to my husband wanting custody so he won’t have to pay child support.
…….. I was shocked to find that everyone lied about me, not one sentance was true, They even punished me for not lying too,
my kids were traumitized and I haven’t been able to match my socks since.

Comment by suzanne cyr — September 16, 2010 @ 4:02 pm

Son with autism. Jumped off bed several days ago leaving a brush burn, 2 days later it is a faint bruise. He is a sensory seeking child with not much perception of danger. His room is equipped with padded floor for this very issue. (jumping off bed) He was told that next time we may have to spank if he chooses to continue jumping off the bed. Day after sent note to school explaining the mark knowing he was proud of it and mommy fixing it with medicine and a bandaid. Apparently 2 days later (yesterday) he told his teacher again about it but got confused saying that mommy spanked him and put medicine on it and it blew up on him. Midday I had a knock at the door from CPS wanting to come in, I had my husband on the phone immediately trying to get in touch with our attorney who was not in. Basically I am being accused of spanking him. They interviewed us and our 4 yr old who also told them we do not spank (time outs only) and that her brother jumped off the bed, mommy put medicine. Wen our son came home he had a blowpop in each hand and a toy in his pocket excited that he told his teacher he got spanked. I asked why he said that and he responded that he likes her and wanted her to hug him. He went on to say he was brought to the office and asked questions sticking to the spanking story because he got hugs, candies and toys. He does not realize what he did and do not know how to get through this. I am scarred because neither i or my husband spanked our son. The worker pressured me for a confession even though my husband, myself and 4 year backed up that he hurt his side jumping off the bed and I put medicine on it after.

Comment by S. — September 25, 2010 @ 11:18 am

I forgot to add that I refused any confession but we were made to sign a form stating that we would not use corporal punishment during the ongoing investigation. I wish I would have known how to handle this and not signing anything but was terrified for my kids and unable to reach a lawyer.

Comment by S. — September 25, 2010 @ 11:22 am

S, you should register at our message board; there are two other mothers active on the board now that have situations involving their autistic children. It is a good place to get feedback on your case. Use a fake name to register!

Comment by Linda Martin — September 25, 2010 @ 3:19 pm

I am having difficulty registering. My email is active, no spam filter yet not receiving the activation. I have sent for the activation multiple times but not receiving it. Also, I have a bit of an update. Sons previous teacher called a friend of hers that happens to be the head supervisor of CPS here. No specifics could be shared obviously but was told that if there was concern she would have had a file in her possession same day and nothing concerning us was given to her. She also said she did not feel we have reason to worry and it would most likely be dropped. Also, if something came up she would call back so we could be notified. She feels we were interview because they are required to check on all reports but did not feel there was an issue here. Praying this will be resolved as soon as possible so we can try and regain some sense of security in our home that was lost by this invasion.

Comment by S. — September 27, 2010 @ 8:04 pm

S – you can send me a request for help registering on the message board. My email link is at the top of the forum page. On this section of the site, it is at the bottom of the page. I will be happy to help you register.

I too have hope that your case will soon be closed! Recovering a sense of trust is difficult after an investigation.

Comment by Linda Martin — September 28, 2010 @ 8:36 am

I was interviewed by an adoption social worker who volunteered to fill out my questionnaire for me while interviewing me. At the end of the interview we reached an impasse over the definition of corporal punishment. As she started to leave, I asked to review the document and sign it. I was told she was going to retype it and return form so I could sign. I was then told the child I was raining could be taken away from me. Less than two weeks later I was summoned to a meeting to discuss adoption plans when child was removed from my custody. What I did not sign was used and embellished and used against me. Don’t matter if you don’t sign, they do what they wish not compelled to honor law.

Comment by D J — October 1, 2010 @ 12:00 pm

two cps workers came into my house and conducted what I now believe to be an illegal search. They proceeded to take pictures without my permission, made me remove my infant’s clothing and still took him after substantial proof that my son had no known bruises and even received a clean bill of health from an emt. Their reasons for taking him were because my house was messy and my son’s head was slightly flat as well as having a tiny diaper rash which they falsely labeled as “severe”in the court papers.

Comment by candy — October 17, 2010 @ 11:03 am

So sorry, ((Candy)) … how long ago was this? You can join our message board forum for feedback on your case.

Comment by Linda Martin — October 18, 2010 @ 8:44 am

Wow I don’t know what is going to happen now. I signed a ” Child Safety Evaluation and Plan” without a lawyer present. I didn’t know much about CPS,the laws or my rights. The agent gave me a pamplet but didnt give me time to read it, he just bombarded me with questions. He presented it like I need to sign that paper if I want to keep my 6 year old son. He vaguely described what it really means. The pamplet states: If it has been determined that the child is at risk of abuse or neglect, the case worker will decide if: immediate safety services are needed. The caseworker will get approval from his supervisor. He left to get approval from his supervisor and scared me into signing. I still have my son but I am terrified and don’t know what to do. The family “task” is even vague. It says I agree to cooperate with CPS/ follow CPS recommendations. That could be anything. It says I agree to participate in parenting classes. The lady who runs the class wants to meet with me to “talk” but Im afraid she’s just trying to get info to make me incriminate myself. They claim the complaint was made 6 months ago at my son’s old school and when they interviewed him (without my knowing, me being there, or my consent) and he said I hit him. He was 5 and could have easily been confused. I would never hurt or abuse him. Is there any way I can get this plan removed?? I wish I didnt let my fear get the best of me and sign that paper.

Comment by Brittany — October 29, 2010 @ 6:40 am

Brittany, if you refuse to cooperate with the services they’re likely to take you to court. Seems strange though, that the incident took place so long ago. Why would they investigate you five months later?

Best thing to do: get a lawyer.

Second best thing: try to cooperate with the service plan and hope for the best. Put aside your fears… what’s done is done. Stay friendly and don’t argue with them as they can use that against you.

You don’t need to give them a lot of leads to anyone… if they ask for them, just say you’ll contact your lawyer about that and have him get back to them. (or something like that).

The #1 thing that keeps a CPS case from getting worse is a good CPS defense lawyer.

Comment by Linda Martin — October 30, 2010 @ 2:54 pm

i have a family problem and i really need some answer here a little gril in are family is saying that my brother touch her and told her not to say nothing. but my brother be lock up for up to 2 year and 3 months in and out at frist he was working and start to miss up at the end hang out with the wrong people but the little gril mother was all going out with her frends and her son and drougher was at someone house and know the cps what to talk to my two little sister because something something did happ. to that little girl they dont know when but they know something happ. to her i really dont know what to do. and i dont what my mother to get sick on use for that really what sould i do.

Comment by gina — November 8, 2010 @ 6:23 pm

Gina, your family may want to find a defense attorney and talk to him or her about it. Without knowing the details of your situation, that’s all I can suggest. It is best to have a lawyer at the beginning and to say *nothing* to the police, but let the lawyer handle everything.

Comment by Linda Martin — November 8, 2010 @ 7:09 pm

My long ex-wife, recent ex-domestic partner did kidnap our two children and hide them from me in hotels, I filed parental kidnapping charges (which have dissappeared??). The children were returned to me–I have sole custody of one, there is nothing ordered on the other–along with a ton of B.S. accusations. I let detectives search my house, my parents house was raided, nothing was found in either place, because the accusations are false. However, I regretably committed to a drug-evaluation and 6 months worth of calling every-day random drug screening. DO I HAVE TO DO THIS?? I have NEVER been an addict, never been convicted of any drug-related charges (she has, as well as living in a drug-house, condemned, 25+ yr history of substantiated neglect and abuse of 7 children, criminal record of B. & E. and Domestic Violence) Right now there is nothing court ordered, as the court date is upcoming, but what are my legal options??

Comment by Brent — November 22, 2010 @ 7:00 am

Brent, I hope you have a lawyer to advise you. You don’t have to do the drug testing but CPS workers will say it looks suspicious if you refuse and then will take you to court. Since you already have a court date, tell the judge then that the testing is not needed. Possibly he or she will tell CPS you don’t need to continue. You’re welcome to register at our message board for more feedback on your case.

Comment by Linda Martin — November 22, 2010 @ 10:18 am

I was caught up in domestic violence for 7 years, my husband would drink alot and one day I left. I went to the police and it turned into a family violence situation because my three girls witnessed what happened the last time. I went to a womens shelter and stayed there for about a month, til my time expired there. I stayed in motels. So CPS thought I had contact with the father, and gave me a choice of voluntarily giving custody to my parents or taking it to court. I signed the paper to give voluntary custody to my parents, to not start trouble with CPS. I can’t stay overnight with the kids and I cannot be alone with the kids. It’s like they are treating me like I abused my children. They said I was negligent for not saying anything in the first place about anything that was happening in the house. They want the kids to go to couseling, and they want me to go to classes and cousenling also. CPS has threatened that the kids will go into foster homes if I don’t comply. Their father has stopped, drinking and changed as a person and me and him have partnered up in trying to get our kids back. What is your best advice on what to do?

Comment by Valerie — December 16, 2010 @ 11:14 am

Valerie, they will never give you back your children so long as you’re living with a man who battered you. The more often you go back to a batterer, the more you’re showing them you can’t be trusted to stay away from one.

I know they’re very persuasive and charming, and that you love him and think you can’t go on without him… but very few batterers ever change, and this particular one is causing you to lose your kids forever.

FYI – my CPS case 20 years ago was based on domestic violence. I had to leave the batterer and got my child back after only eight months… and raised her on my own. Unless you’re dedicated to leaving him, there’s no possibility you’re going to get your child back. Believe me, I know it is difficult, but that’s the choice you’ve got to make.

Comment by Linda Martin — December 16, 2010 @ 12:54 pm

I dont want to sound like a sales man but. i have pre paid legal services. They will tell you what rights u have to fight them from the start. meaning when they come to your door call them and they will let you know what to do and your rights in all 50 states. kinda nice to have a lawyer at your side when they want to come in your house.

If ya want more info on this my email is markalfa-at-hotmail.com

Comment by Richard W — January 18, 2011 @ 10:39 am

In may of 2010 I had a son with a severe heart defect..My OBGYN during my pregnancy wrote a report to CPS because Of UA results.. I had Proof of everything that Came up on my UA. CPS came 4 days after my son was born And pretty much made me sign a voluntary placement form for them to take my son. It took 4 months to get him back and I feel CPS didnt have a right to have my son in there care for that long. I got him back September 14th 2010 he had open heart surgery on the 30th and passed away october 4th 2010. I got 2 weeks with my baby boy and all my cps worker said was she was sorry.I never got a copy of there reports either. Please can anyone help me with what to do against cps im so angry with them and after my son passed away I havent heard from them since.. Thank you
Sarah My email is sarahgarcia216 -at- yahoo.com

Comment by Sarah — March 3, 2011 @ 4:00 am

I went to an organization with my husband and 11 month old son seeking services. While my sister was changing his diaper, the social worker noticed a burn on his hand. They detained us for a considerable amount of time and later it was found that they called CPS. Due to some surgeries I’ve recently had, I am being accused of being a drug addict, they want all of my hospital records, pharmacy reports, etc…. We were there seeking help for housing, CPS has decided for us that we are living in a car with our son, please comment.

Comment by Veronica — March 27, 2011 @ 6:46 am

My son’s CPS attorney told him that I tested positive for meth and asked him if I had been partying with people at home in front of him or if I had been hanging around with people and had he seen me doing this? He’s twelve. What right did she have to break confidentiality? And to tell a child that? He never has seen me or been a party to anything of that sort. I used twice and he was at a friend’s on a sleepover both times. That’s all I did. Otherwise I am doing all their bullshit and I am clean as I used to be until a stressful period in my life when I erroneously took what was offered to “Help me relax” on two occassions. I am not an addict or even a recreational user. I had to test the day after smoking meth one evening and two days after the other time. That was it. They say that because I don’t have a receipt for the one test that it shows that I was “dirty”. Any missed test is logged as a dirty according to California. Is that right?

Comment by Robin — June 22, 2011 @ 11:25 pm

I signed a voluntary safety plan no court order. No child abuse was passed out drunk one time father was sober and present can I go take my kids back if I still have full custody? I do not drink on a regular basis. I have done everything they want its been 7 months. What do I do?

Comment by Kristina — October 9, 2011 @ 6:06 am

Kristina, you need an attorney! Even if you can’t afford it, try for some consultations to see what kind of response you get.

You could also apply with the state department of social services for an administrative hearing, but that will take a few months for results. Might be good to start now but see an attorney or two or three first!

Comment by Linda Martin — October 9, 2011 @ 10:53 am

i have a cps case due to domestic violence the 1st time he was convincted and given 2yrs the 2nd time the cops got cps involved but i didnt see who assaulted me because our past they assumed it was him the charges were dismissed by the state i guess. I signed the first safety plan and refused all others after. 7months later My bf was released now shes threatning to take me to court if i dnt sign it do i have to sign? why didnt it matter before? now she lying and saying i didnt comply with my classes

Comment by melissa — December 20, 2011 @ 12:53 am

she says thats why they kicked me out which is nottrue. i had one class to go and my conselor was going to complete my classes but my insurance ended so she couldnt see me anymore my caseworker had said i had do both classes over. now she changing the story into me not cooperating which is a lie and she said i cant prove it.

Comment by melissa — December 20, 2011 @ 1:03 am

Melissa, are you back with the abusive boyfriend? Caseworkers don’t like having known abusive people near children. You can get feedback on your situation from our message board.

About the parenting classes – didn’t the facilitator of the class keep track of attendance? They usually keep track and often even issue certificates to those who fulfill requirements.

Comment by Linda Martin — December 22, 2011 @ 3:59 pm

We were staying ocean front with our kids and my parents at the beach and it was my first day letting my baby go out on the beach with my husband . We rented a red beach umbrella for the week and I bought an SPF 50 beach hat for him . Our oldest son 14 had for gotten swim suit and his best friend and best friends mom a (professor) and I went a block and bought him one when I got back an hour later I noticed the baby was a little red .I asked husband why he didn t use the sun lotion in the baby bag and he said it clearly states not to use on babies under 6mos of age with out calling Dr and it does he did not bring his cell to call Dr and it was over cast so when I got back they closed the beach due to a storm .The next morning around 10 am I put baby lotion on him lied him on the condo bed spread and his face started to swell up we took him to hospital and the gave him benadryl and IV and commented on his sunburn I told them my story and now we go to court . Our Dr sent us a month later to an Allergy specialist who told us our son was highly allergic to dogs we stayed in a pet friendly condo .CPS wants me to admit neglect due to my son Sunburn and I can t do that I was not on the beach and I did evetything to protect my child . They are not attacking my husband just me. I need a lawyer and we can afford it however there are not many CINA lawyers.

Comment by jennifer — January 2, 2012 @ 8:32 am

I cannot even begin to list all the grievances I have with CPS in the state of California. Within several months of arriving at a women’s shelter [the domestic violence occurred within two weeks of moving to CA after spending the first quarter century of my life in Memphis, TN] my 3 year old son was taken from me. Ironically enough this was weeks after the CPS worker had met with me, determined all was well, and ‘closed’ the case.

At that time– and the official reason[s] for his detention changed CONSTANTLY– it was because of my ‘abuse’ and ‘neglect.’ Said ‘abuse’ came from him overshooting his landing while jumping on a bed and bruising his face on a bed side table; the neglect came from ‘unkempt’ clothes for one week only at his school– due to us staying in a hotel and not having a vehicle or access to laundry facilities until my apartment was available.

My estranged husband made a horrific report about me [and apparently my attorney and I were the only ones who thought it was worth noting that this happened the day after he was arrested for domestic violence] which CPS accepted without question. I will forever regret signing the ‘parenting plan’ before I retained my attorney.

Once I got a lawyer, they removed the initial social worker and put an official with more seniority on the case. She hasn’t been much better. Countless facts that could have been easily proven false with a phone call were allowed in this report and to this day they refuse to amend it! On the witness stand my attorney even got her to admit that she didn’t verify the report or do any research, just accepted what was handed to her from the previous worker and conducted an additional interview with me.

This is a NIGHTMARE. Child Endangerment Services is more like it. My poor son is forever traumatized and I’m due to give birth to a girl in three weeks. I just know they’ll do anything to try and take her….

Comment by Sloane — January 22, 2012 @ 11:48 pm

I have had 3 children removed from my care. Long story short, they say its abuse/nneglect at no fault of the mother. I have anxiety problems and have had supervised visits for nearly 3 years now. The grandma of the girls is adopting them. I will relinquish my right next month. My dilemma? I’m 3 months pregnant. Can cps come to the hospital and immediately take custody of my baby? A few things: I have had my anxiety under control and have had no bad reports from the workers doing my visits with my girls. I live in my own apartment and have obtained a job, pretty much everything in the last court order has been fixed. Can they use my previous case as a reason to open another case? (Note: I will be relinquishing next month to my other kids,meaning that case will be closed) or do they have to have a reason(my child being in imminent danger) to come and open a case? And my attorney(court appointed) says they may make me do a “voluntary” should I sign the voluntary or refuse everything if they allege false statements?

Comment by monica — January 23, 2012 @ 5:10 pm

Monica, in many areas they will try to take your infant at birth. If there’s been a termination of parental rights they can use that as a reason. It might be a good idea to move away from that area to protect your unborn child, but would that interfere with your ability to visit your other children? Join us on our message board for more feedback on your case.

Comment by Linda Martin — January 24, 2012 @ 10:40 pm

Sign Nothing, Without An Attorney Present

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